/me wanders in with further updates
hopefully the machine will hold together long enough to post this.

right, earlier today the last remaining "common thread" to all of this broke. i had a hard lock while off line.

/me *takes deep breaths and tries to think in a calm and straight line*

i have also had a spontaneous reboot today, while moving some files i had just backed up from drive D to drive E (different partitions, same physical hard drive).

also, it is time i replied to some of you helpful people in more depth.

WOM - My machine used to do that. Both cases. When I stopped using logons and deleted the program and reloaded XP everything was ok.

that is very interesting. i have already uninstalled logon, about 1 or 2 weeks ago, trying to remove variables. this did fix a problem with the SDTaskManager plugin i am using in my OB theme, but hasn't stopped the main problems.

dark_minion - You can check the log files to see if it is software causing the issues, and if so, what software?

there are no hints in the system event logs. i think i already mentioned that. i have checked many times, hoping for a clue.

dark_minion - System restore back to a date when all was well with your system.

i don't know when that was, since i have been tracking this problem for a while now. the problem is definitely getting worse!!! the average uptime between crashes is going down.

dark_minion - System file checker. Insert your Windows XP CD while holding down the left shift key to stop it auto-running, click start, click run, type in (sans quotes "sfc /scannow"), sit back and let system file checker do it's thing.

ran this, it said give me the winXP CD. the CD was already in the drive, i know this, it auto played when i inserted it. removing and replacing the CD didn't help. i had to reboot to close the system file checker, since there was no other way out of it.

dark_minion - Check disk with the repair switch. The repair switch has five stages and is the most effective switch to use with check disk. Be warned however that it takes quite a while to complete. Click start, click run, type in "chkdsk /r" (again, sans quotes"), and click OK.

i ran this, it checked D drive for me. there are 3 drives (all partitions) C, D and E.
i have a dual boot, win98 on C drive for games winXP doesn't like, fat32 format
winXP on D drive, NTFS format
data on E drive, so i can reformat D drive with more ease in an emergency, again NTFS format.

the checker finished, listed the output on the screen, and then as i started to read the output the machine rebooted. so, i don't really know what it said, but i think it said zero bad sectors. is this normal behaviour???


the spontaneous reboot reminded me of the total ****** caused by installing the nvidia 28.xx (i think) drivers on my machine, with the old bios. this was quite some time ago, and left me with a machine with an average up time of 1 hour.

so, remembering that i uninstalled the 40.72 drivers i am using, ran a program (nasty file remover 0.7) to try and clean out the last traces, and then installed the 23.11 drivers i was using before the HD crash about 1 month ago.

i have had another hard lock since then. so, that was inconclusive.


then..

IPlural - feline, do me a favour and do a reboot, hit DEL when it asks to load the CMOS setup, then hit the F-(key) that will be on the screen for loading system defaults.

i did this. there are two default options, and i selected "load optimised defaults". this was about 1 hour ago, and i have not had a crash since. however, it is far to soon for that to mean anything.

yrag - I went back and read the thread you had a couple of weeks ago, along with this one and tried to find a common denominator. The in and out of the graphics card to no avail and then your computer guy does it and it works leads to me to believe it's some other piece of hardware. Since it would have be something that works all the time because the different things you're doing when it crashes it narrows it down to really only two items...your mouse or your keyboard.

interesting, i hadn't thought of that.
i have never had a problem booting the machine, and the keyboard (microsoft bendy keyboard) is one i have had for quite some time.

the mouse is a Microsoft optical (blue) mouse, with a cord, USB connection. this is quite new. so, since i do have a couple of other mice i will try this next if i get another hard lock / reboot.


reading the post about the system restore point again, i have tried to work out when all this mess started. it *may* have been around the time i downgraded the video drivers in order to get the DVD playback to work. this suggests it *may* be a major video driver problem (again). if so, based on last time, and what i have done today, i will need to wipe this partition, and do a full reinstall of everything.

hard ware is the other obvious possibility. thankfully i do have a local hardware expert who is trustworthy. as for playing with the cards, given my track record i am very loath to do so.

well, if this post goes then i have been up long enough to make and post this, which is nice.

i have a dual boot, win98 on C drive for games winXP doesn't like, fat32 formatwinXP on D drive, NTFS formatdata on E drive, so i can reformat D drive with more ease in an emergency, again NTFS format.

That is probably where the problem lies.... Most people would not recommend using different operating systems and different filing systems all on the same drive,even though the one drive is partitioned I think it's possible to create conflicts.

anthony roberts - That is probably where the problem lies.... Most people would not recommend using different operating systems and different filing systems all on the same drive,even though the one drive is partitioned I think it's possible to create conflicts.

i havent heard that before. i have been doing this for years, starting with a dual boot between win95 and winNT4.

i am starting to miss my old machine, which dual booted between win98 and win2k. it was rock solid stable *sigh*

new info: last night, after i did the BIOS settings re-set i got a blue screen of death.

this is the first time i have seen this, but it is only recently i changed the system error handling settings so no longer restart on a fatal error.

i have had both spontanious reboots and hard locks since changing that setting, so i seem to have 3 different forms of this problem, or 3 different problems.

the interesting thing about this blue screen is i wasnt even in front of my machine when it happened, so it wasnt triggered by me actively doing something.

the info from the blue screen is:

DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL

Stop 0x000000D1 (0x00000000, 0x00000002, 0x00000001, 0xF8847C3E)

processr.sys - Address F8847C3E base at F8846000, DateStamp 3b7d8320

i have done some searches at microsoft.com and in google. these are all suggesting:
* a hardware fault, RAM is a favourate
* a hardware conflict
* bad drivers, with some people saying nvidia drivers can cause this

since the hardware hasnt changed before vs after the HD crash, moving up to the latest available nvidia drivers, and then moving down in order to fix the DVD playback looks like the favourate theory right now.

i have already run a RAM checker program, and that came up clean.

however, to fix the nvidia drivers (if that is really the cause) looks like it will need a format, and a clean reinstall of winXP

feline....I had similar problems with the same BSOD as you call it...though it's probably more correctly called a memory dump.....mine was caused by a virus scanner not actually supported/designed for XP...though it had been fine with every ver of Doze up to and including 2000....in other words...a simple proggy problem....it would also kill my wow.exe ability to run old 16 bit proggies....and one annoying thing was that ACAD2000 uses a 16 bit installer...

The only way I solved it was a process of elimination......adding one proggy at a time to a virgin install and waiting to see what caused a dump...

DRIVER_IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUALStop 0x000000D1 (0x00000000, 0x00000002, 0x00000001, 0xF8847C3E)processr.sys - Address F8847C3E base at F8846000, DateStamp 3b7d8320

feline- that is a bios induced hardware resources dump. Go back and read #22. It appears that resources assigned by your bios are not the same as your software..namely Windows. It could be as simple as having two 'processor.sys' files or a corrupt one in your System32 folder. If it's two get rid of the oldest. If it corrupted you can do a repair using the Win CD

yrag - It could be as simple as having two 'processor.sys' files or a corrupt one in your System32 folder. If it's two get rid of the oldest. If it corrupted you can do a repair using the Win CD

i will check for more that one of these files tonight. however, i have already tried a file check scan, and it refused to see my winXP cd, making it rather hard to run it *sigh*

Jafo - The only way I solved it was a process of elimination......adding one proggy at a time to a virgin install and waiting to see what caused a dump...

yep, i am rapidly moving that way myself. unless i have a brain wave, it is format time tonight. then, i will just have to build up the machine increadibly slowly, and see if / when things start to behave in a strange way.

and if the format doesnt fix it, then it is hardware prodding time.

So far I haven't come across this problem, but it is interesting to view the comments

and it refused to see my winXP cd, making it rather hard to run it *sigh*

This is like 'the computer from hell' I admire your patience...I think I would have blown it up by now. Before you do as Jafo suggests (and I think that's where you'll end up) go to Device Manager and Un-install whatever is listed under 'Processor' tab and re-boot. Also, before you do that, when you look in Sys32 folder you'll be looking not only to make sure that 'processor.sys' exists, but look for any others that might be there. They will be under different names...proces~1.sys, processor.bak, etc...anyway you get the idea. You might even want to delete the 'processr.sys' file itself so that on a re-boot it gets a good file from Windows backup files.

Good luck with this mission...this tape will self-destruct in 5 seconds

yrag, i will try that, thanks.

as for the cause of all this, my pet theory is that nvidia drivers are the sole and total cause. i have been here once before, so it would make sense. i just have no good idea *why* they should be so insanely lethal.

*sigh* no over clocking, good quality components, carefully put together by the hardware expert. i look after my machine. well, if the format fixes this, and suggests the drivers really are the cause it is time to save up and get a nice ATI radion graphics card.

Feline get out of the house ...we have traced the calls and they are coming from inside the computer

Yeah, I am a one OS per computer type of guy …. I do not use partitions either because of problems I have experienced with them. I only use laptops… cant stand desktops, I speaketh the queens English.

Is it Ok to run into a crowded fire and yell theatre?

ATI drivers run into the same thing...although they've really gotten their act together of late. Since you have a Geforce 2 you might want to drop down to a Detonator 3 driver (the 4 series seems to be a little 'punch-drunk' lately). The 3 series will give you everything your card is capable of and you won't have the hassle of the new drivers for the things you can't use........http://www.nvidia.com/view.asp?IO=winxp-2k_archive

feline, what make is your motherboard?

I had a similar issue to this when the fan went on my video card.  It's
amazing what a little overheating can do to your video card.

Is it Ok to run into a crowded fire and yell theatre?

Only if you have chocolate &/or marshmallows.

if the format fixes this

....................

it is time to save up and get a nice ATI radion graphics card

Feline, I just bought a new Radeon 9500 128mb (Connect 3d) for 145.00 USD. Free shipping. It was more than I wanted to pay, but it really works well and is rock solid.

If it really is the nvidia driver's fault, you may be able to increase stability or even fix the problem by going to display properties-settings tab, advanced button-troubleshooting tab and turning down hardware acceleration. The settings there will turn of video card acceleration of the windows (like cursor and other image acceleration in windows). Try turning acceleration all the way down first and stpe it up slowly if there are no problems.

yrag - Also, before you do that, when you look in Sys32 folder you'll be looking not only to make sure that 'processor.sys' exists, but look for any others that might be there.

i looked, and there is no sign of any other versions of this file, no backups, etc.

well, my machine was stable last night, however i have had enough of this waiting for it to crash again game. so, i spent last night double checking my backups were up to date. the plan is to format and start a very slow rebuild tonight.

yrag - ATI drivers run into the same thing...although they've really gotten their act together of late. Since you have a Geforce 2 you might want to drop down to a Detonator 3 driver (the 4 series seems to be a little 'punch-drunk' lately). The 3 series will give you everything your card is capable of and you won't have the hassle of the new drivers for the things you can't use........ Link

hehe, i know how ATI drivers used to be. i had an ATI expert at work card back when i first tried winNT4. the pain i went through with driver games on that machine! that was why i got a nvidia card this time around.

as for the drivers, i was going to try the 23.11 ones, since they seemed quite stable for me before the HD crash. if i have any concerns over them, i will try the series 3 ones. thanks for the hint.

well, last night i did the format and reinstall of winXP. it seemed to go smoothly. the only program i have installed so far is PowerDesk5, since i simply cannot use windows explorer effectively, it is so limiting.

i have not installed any drivers, so the only drivers present are the ones windows applied during the install process.

so, having got the machine up and running, i went online to check my email. this is where the new problem showed up.

the internet setting appear to be correct. i can dial and connect ok. i can even receive email. but i could not send email. i could not log into wincustomize.com. and at another forum site where i go i was unable to make a single post. the posts would not upload.

it is almost as if i had no ability to upload any data at all. however, i did manage to perform a google search, and i could follow links.

so, perhaps this strange and bizarre problem was due to an ISP issue, and it will be fixed by tonight. if so it is something of a coincidence that this happened just after a format and a clean install of winXP.

and if it is not the ISP.......

*sigh* /me heads for the marathon thread to make a voodoo like sacrifice to the gods.

this is the most sensible course of action left to me at this point in time.

in your outlook express settings make sure your SMTP (outgoing) Server is setup to use the same settings as your POP3 (incoming)...

IPlural, thanks for the idea. however, i had already done that.

well, last night (24 hours after the problem first showed up) it was still there. i have checked and double checked the settings in outlook express and they seem correct.

so, i booted up my backup machine, and set up outlook express on there. normally i don't do this because it splits my email across two machines, but i needed to test this.

well, i can send and receive email from the backup machine, using the same settings as my main machine.

the main machine uses an external 56k modem connected to COM1 (i can watch the lights, which is useful), and the backup machine uses an old 33k modem which can only download at 1k per sec, not the 3k per sec i would expect.

so, tonights experiment is to try the external modem on the backup machine, to see if it is the modem which is at fault.

however, there is one other fact which i am currently in denial over. when i did the format i booted to win98 to use auto play on the winXP CD to kick start the winXP installer.

obviously this required booting win98. however, when i did this the first boot (it started loading win98) didn't result in win98 running, instead it resulted in the machine rebooting. on the second attempt i got a scan disk ("win98 didn't shut down properly", yes, i noticed) after which it loaded ok.

well, i am ignoring this for now, but it really is starting to look like some strange hardware problem is at the root of all of this

The Win98 start problem You described indeed cries for a hardware fault somewhere. But I wonder why You installed 98 at all ? And : Not using NTFS as file system ?

just made a post and don't know where it went... let's try again...
feline...forget the Win98 boot disk...go into bios and change 1st boot device to CD rom. After XP installs and starts to re-boot, go into bios and change 1st device back to HDD.

c242 - The Win98 start problem You described indeed cries for a hardware fault somewhere. But I wonder why You installed 98 at all ? And : Not using NTFS as file system ?

i am not sure what you mean about not using NTFS. winXP is using NTFS.

win98 is there so i can play Rogue Squadron and Civilization 3. also, it is good for experiments that may be dangerous, like installing strange shareware programs that look interesting.

Rogue Squadron does install on winXP, but is prone to crashing even with every compatibility option i can find set to max.

as for Civilization 3, when i installed it on winXP, it nuked getright, outlook, my firewall, and at least one other program, the name of which i forget. i am assured by tech support this cannot happen, but since i had to do a system restore to get a working machine, i don't believe them. that was nearly a year ago now though, so no connection with the current load of issues. my best guess is the Civ3 problem was something to do with modifications to allow it to read / use the copy protection on the CD. i do know i am not the only person to have had big headaches with Civ3 and winXP, while others have had no problems.