gallagher118

Join Date 07/2005

Patience for crashes running thin

I just started a new job, and therefore can only find time here and there. (was happily un-employed for last year (extended vacation)). I've had a game going for over a week now, I TRY to play for around an hour here and there. But it's getting harder since almost every time i play I end up with a lockup, an out of memory, or just a crash to desktop. I used to soldier on, send in the exception data, but I'm getting disgusted.

I had thought getting the expansion was a no-brainer, but now I'm really not so sure. I'm beginning to think I'd be better off waiting 6 months or so after the release while you work out the bugs. (and don't add any more)

Seriously Stardock what the hell are you doing ? GC1 on OS2 I never once updated the game and was completely happy. GC1 on PC, again completely happy, and didn't even realize I could update it for around a year. (and then got another 6 months out it)

GC2 I've been playing solidly since it came out, but how many updates have there been and I'm still having basic stability problems ? The only reason I'm still playing is I like the game, and don't have the time to invest in something else.

Please get a handle on the problems, or I think even the fan-boys are going to start realizing their folly.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

an out of memory

This alone indicates to me that you're running the 1.3 beta patches. Unless you're willing to deal with the potential problems, you should not be running non-final patches. The beta patches are only provided for those who are willing to test them and aware that they can and probably will introduce new issues in the short-term.

Seriously Stardock what the hell are you doing ? GC1 on OS2 I never once updated the game and was completely happy. GC1 on PC, again completely happy, and didn't even realize I could update it for around a year. (and then got another 6 months out it)

GC2 I've been playing solidly since it came out, but how many updates have there been and I'm still having basic stability problems ? The only reason I'm still playing is I like the game, and don't have the time to invest in something else.

GC2 is by far more complex than any of its predecessors, and has found its way onto far more and more varied systems than any of its predecessors did. As such it is inevitable that some systems will have issues.

If you are indeed having problems, it might help to post your debug.err here so we can see if it may be a common system configuration issue at the heart of the matter. Sending in SE reports is great, but if it's your system causing the crashes and not the code, you'll just be sending the devs off on a wild goose chase.

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Just setup your game to save every two turns and reload when the game crashes. Thats what I do. That being said.

I played 1.3 Beta 2 for 36 hours straight. I played 1.3 Beta 2a for 8 hours crash to desktop Program Error Box.

Serious I don't know what you guys changed to cause the more constant crash. But please stability for 1.3

Also PS: I noticed a crash when the AI invaded me with overwhelming odds. (Mass Driver/Tidal Disruption. please check out the invasion code something in it has been broken. Example my Mod INVADER-Mod really has alot of invasion crashes with 1.3 beta 1,2, and 2a. I have to play the game un modded becuase of crashes during adding advanced troop mods. the AI invades with overwhelming odds. Or an number of invasion leading tactics. Something is broken there please check.

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Frogboy

Join Date 03/2001

+2417

Guys - DO NOT PLAY BETA VERSIONS IF STABILITY IS YOUR OVERRIDING GOAL.

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Guys - DO NOT PLAY BETA VERSIONS IF STABILITY IS YOUR OVERRIDING GOAL.

Thats why were testing this beta to make sure you guys don't release another 1.2. 1.2 Final was in no way, shape, or form stable.

I always test the betas to find the bugs that may disturb my mod. I'm just telling you what I've sesn in the game and reporting bugs.

But after the 1.2 final instability I can't NOT test the Beta.(Especially if the finals are just as crashy as the betas) you might as well play the Betas and test them too.

This is not to get you angry, this just letting you know, "games not stable enough." "fix it."

If no one complains or posts bugs it won't get fixed.

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Still amazes me how people expect a beta to be rock solid.... That being said, I haven't noticed any problems in game with beta (though I think I am still and beta 1) except when I quit it errors out....but then, I'm quitting anyways so who cares

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I understand it's a beta, but as others have pointed out, even the non-betas have not been terribly stable.

For me I have to play the beta, playing against the AI at maso is getting too easy for me. Jumping to suicidal is just too much advantage for the AI.

And I do autosave every 2 turns, and I used to send in exception data. I used to just reload and startup again, but as I've said my patience is wearing thin. How long can you be forgiving for these sorts of bugs ? What should we expect of the expansion ? Will people praise stardock all over again for making us pay for what should be a beta ?

Don't get me wrong I love this game, I'd really like to see the right attention go into the expansion.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

I reiterate:

If you are indeed having problems, it might help to post your debug.err here so we can see if it may be a common system configuration issue at the heart of the matter. Sending in SE reports is great, but if it's your system causing the crashes and not the code, you'll just be sending the devs off on a wild goose chase.

Personally, I haven't had any crashes on three different systems since before the game was released.

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I crashed last night on version 1.2.
It was a real surprise, because GC2 very seldom has problems on my system other than choppy audio. And that is probably something in my system that I have been unable to track down, because my nephew does not have the problem.

But I never have out of memory issues.

All of the problems mentioned by the OP could be video or audio driver related, corrupt OS or game files, incorrect settings, or any number of interfering background processes.

Like Darth Kryo said, it would help if the debug.err contents were posted.
Without doing at least that small step it is useless to cry about crashes.

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Thats why were testing this beta to make sure you guys don't release another 1.2. 1.2 Final was in no way, shape, or form stable.

Say what? I think you need to look a bit closer to home to find the cause of your instability. v1.2 is rock solid - I've played half a dozen long gigantic games and not had a single crash or lockup that was attributable to GC2.

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I agree.

I loaded my autosave game from the crash. That first turn the Drengi attacked me, so perhaps it was a combination of them declaring war, completing a tech, maybe a planet flipping - who knows.

Strange game, that last game. I was attacked twice, first by the Arceans and then the Drengin. Niether time did they declare war, but pulled surprise attacks.
And that is the first game in a long time that the mini-map and graph did not mess up on me at some point. Usually, it seems that once I get a certain number of planets to flip through influence the mini-map gets the repaint problem, and shortly thereafter the graphs stop working. Not in this game though, and I ended up with 150 planets and 67% influence by the time I got a tech victory.

But 1.2 has been a very stable build for me, other than a few little quirks that are mostly being addressed in 1.3.

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hats why were testing this beta to make sure you guys don't release another 1.2. 1.2 Final was in no way, shape, or form stable.

I always test the betas to find the bugs that may disturb my mod. I'm just telling you what I've sesn in the game and reporting bugs.

But after the 1.2 final instability I can't NOT test the Beta.(Especially if the finals are just as crashy as the betas) you might as well play the Betas and test them too.

This is not to get you angry, this just letting you know, "games not stable enough." "fix it."

If no one complains or posts bugs it won't get fixed.

Uhhh, hate to break it to you, but unless you've posted debug.err logs or provided pertinent information in other threads beyond that which you've contributed to this thread, you're not really assisting the beta testing process. It'd be like being a book editor, reading an author's rough draft, and then telling him 'it has some problems somewhere between the first and last page' without marking them in some fashion.

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It's not a system problem for me. Some of the many versions out there were stable for my computer. The beta I'm playing is obviously bad, but I started a game with it and would like to finish it out. (if i can, i just played the same 2 turns I've played 3 times previously.)

MY POINT IS :

STARDOCK NEEDS TO SPEND MORE TIME POLISHING, AND TESTING.

AND please don't deliver a buggy expansion for us to debug for you.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

MY POINT IS :

STARDOCK NEEDS TO SPEND MORE TIME POLISHING, AND TESTING.

AND please don't deliver a buggy expansion for us to debug for you.

If *you* are having problems, you can't expect Stardock to somehow know what your configuration is in order to test the game on it without providing some info. It was tested on a variety of machines, and far more people have had a completely crash-free experience than have not (after release the numbers were calculated to be less than 3% of users having any significant issues at all). As I've said, I haven't had a crash myself since before the game was even released. Not even with the various beta patches since then, and certainly not with the recent ones you say are so unstable, which I've spent numerous hours testing specifically, on multiple computers.

You seem to not want to admit it but it's entirely possible that some part of your system is at least partly at fault. The least you can do is provide us a small bit of information, rather than vague complaints that help noone. Even if we can't do anything about it now, knowing about your system gives us more information to work with.

If you won't do that, you're just wasting your and our time.

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I do autosave every 2 turns, and I used to send in exception data. I used to just reload and startup again, but as I've said my patience is wearing thin. How long can you be forgiving for these sorts of bugs ?

Exactly, I love how you say that then they say this. (BTW I do as well post my debug.err and send in my smart exception reports.)

Uhhh, hate to break it to you, but unless you've posted debug.err logs or provided pertinent information in other threads beyond that which you've contributed to this thread,

If you are indeed having problems, it might help to post your debug.err

My Debug.err was posted here. (before I ever posted in this thread.)

WWW Link

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As I've said, I haven't had a crash myself since before the game was even released

Have you really been playing the game !! ?? There where numerous non-configuration crashes hiding out in this game. When did you start playing, a month ago ? (most notably of these was the "Auto-save" crash)

Look at my metaverse chars, I've been playing quite a while. Stardock's processes for delivering software are faulty, especially early on. They rushed this game out to market. (just go back and look at version 1, it is a joke.)

Here's the end of my debug file :
Debug Message: Save Game: About to save
Debug Message: Saving game C:\Documents and Settings\Glen Gallagher\My Documents\My Games\GalCiv2\QuickSave.sav
Debug Message: Num Sectors Across: 12
Debug Message: Saving: game mode is metaverse.
ASSERT ERROR in file .\Source\memman.cpp at line 1384.
ASSERT ERROR in file .\Source\memman.cpp at line 978.

Ya that looks like a config problem... ( I have a gig of memory, I supose you'll say I should have 2...)

Any way that game is toast. I can't get through that turn (or can't save at least), so I'm getting the newer beta, and will cross my fingers.

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I have not experienced any stability problems with 1.2

My desktop system is a Athlon 64 with an nVidia 7900 GT and it does have a glitch every now and then where it locks during a quicksave. Only happens at the very end of a game when I have most of the game's planets (around 200 in the game). Otherwise, no stability problems. I also play on my laptop which is an Intel Centrino Duo with an ATI X1600. The game is perfectly stable on that system. Haven't had a single problem there.

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kryo

Join Date 05/2003

+458

I have been playing the game since the first public beta. In fact, my name is even in the credits. It's been crash-free for me since the release candidate builds in late Janurary/early February.

The 'out of memory' issue was a known, and quickly fixed problem that required certain conditions in order to occur (large maps, frequent saves and/or loads). I did not encounter it myself as I tend to play small/medium maps all the way through in one sitting, with autosave turned down or off (since it doesn't crash for me to start with, and saving used to be slow).

Ya that looks like a config problem... ( I have a gig of memory, I supose you'll say I should have 2...)

I said it was possible, not guaranteed. Now that you've at least provided a little additional information though, the devs will be better equipped to solve the issue. Thanks for cooperating.

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gallagher118,

Why won't you post the complete contents of the debug.err?

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Because he has now taken a stand and is too proud to step down.

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Well, I am having a hard time believing anything he says.

That could be a snipet from an old debug file, he may be running on version 1.0 for all we know. He may have his game resolution set too high or have outdated drivers.

Too many variables to the information he does provide, and too secretive an attitude from him.

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resolution does not make the game crash

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Yes it can, under the right conditions.
Some crashing problems have been resolved by matching the game and desktop resolutions.

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It's was a god dam save crash !!! What does video have to do with that ?

The newest beta runs fine. (played around 5 hours today with no problems) It's not my drivers. It was the BETA. As I said some of the previous versions ran fine on my PC, some didn't. That's why I am inclined to not believe a system problem.

MY POINT again, was that Stardock is not properly testing (or polishing) their software. I just don't understand why so many of you ignore the crappy job of testing/polishing/balancing that stardock has done.

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Here is my current debug.err. (the one from before is gone obviously) I had been playing the previous beta. (the one with memory problems.)

Perhaps there is something wrong here. So I will "step down" now.

Debug Message: Version v1.3 beta 2a last updated on: Tue Aug 8 16:18:51 2006
Debug Message: *********DXDiag info follows.*********
System Info
Time: 8/13/2006, 11:18:51
DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)
Machine Name: PENTIUM_4
Operating System: Windows XP Home Edition (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp_sp2_gdr.050301-1519)
Languages: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: Dell Computer Corporation
System Model: Dimension 8250
BIOS: Default System BIOS
Processor: Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 2.40GHz
Physical Memory: 1022MB RAM
Page File: 358MB used, 1338MB available
Windows Dir: C:\WINDOWS

Display Info
Display device 1:
Device Name: \\.\DISPLAY1
Card Name: RADEON 9550
Manufacturer: ATI Technologies Inc.
Chip Type: ATI RADEON 9550 AGP (0x4153)
DAC Type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Key Device: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_4153&SUBSYS_04021002&REV_00
Display Memory: 256.0 MB
Current Display Mode: 1280 x 1024 (32 bit) (60Hz)
Monitor Name: Plug and Play Monitor
Monitor Max Resolution: 1600,1200
Driver Name: ati2dvag.dll
Driver Version: 6.14.0010.6614
Driver Date: 5/3/2006 12:51:00
DirectX Acceleration Enabled: Yes

Sound info
Sound device 1:
Description: Sound Blaster Audigy
Default Sound Playback: Yes
Default Voice Playback: Yes
Hardware ID: PCI\VEN_1102&DEV_0007&SUBSYS_100A1102&REV_00
Manufacturer ID: 1
Product ID: 100
Driver Name: P17.sys
Provider: CREATIVE
Driver Version: 5.12.0001.0512
Driver Date: 7/6/2005 20:14:30
Type: WDM
Other Drivers:
Acceleration Level: 3
Cap Flags: 0
Min/Max Sample Rate: 0, 0

Sound device 1:
Description: Modem #1 Line Playback (emulated)
Default Sound Playback: No
Default Voice Playback: No
Hardware ID:
Manufacturer ID: 1
Product ID: 81
Driver Name:
Provider:
Driver Version:
Driver Date:
Type: Emulated
Other Drivers:
Acceleration Level: 3
Cap Flags: 0
Min/Max Sample Rate: 0, 0

Debug Message: *********END dxdiag info.*********
Debug Message: Entering WinMain
Debug Message: ******* Starting Game Shell *******
Debug Message: Going Fullscreen
Debug Message: Preparing to change display settings.
Debug Message: Using multilsample setting: D3DMULTISAMPLE_4_SAMPLES
Debug Message: Game Resolution: 1280 x 1024
Debug Message: Running fullscreen.
Debug Message: HAL (hw vp): RADEON 9550
Debug Message: D3DPRESENT_INTERVAL_DEFAULT
Debug Message: Refresh rate: 60
Debug Message: Bit Depth: 32 bit.
Debug Message: *********Checking D3DDevice Caps***********************
Debug Message: A full-color cursor is supported in hardware at high resolution modes.
Debug Message: RGB in format 6:6:6, Masks reported as ff0000:ff00:ff
Debug Message: Now Fullscreen
Debug Message: Shell initialization complete
Debug Message: ***** Initializing Game *****
Debug Message: Timer Frequency is 0 369e99
Debug Message: Initializing sound card.
Debug Message: initailizing bink
Debug Message: No files found matching mask Gfx\Tutorials\*.bik
Debug Message: Create setup screens.
Debug Message: Clear galaxy settings.
Debug Message: Clear influence.
Debug Message: Clear up laws.
Debug Message: Clear first time events.
Debug Message: Clear wonders and trade goods.
Debug Message: Clear sector mapper.
Debug Message: Set mouse.
Debug Message: Set update timer.
Debug Message: Clear data definitions.
Debug Message: No files found matching mask C:\Documents and Settings\Glen Gallagher\My Documents\My Games\GalCiv2\ships\*.xml
Debug Message: Reading Star Names
Debug Message: Reading Star Names... Done
Debug Message: Clear data definitions.
Debug Message: MetaverseWnd: Cannot find OBJID Metaverse_Character_Race_Title
Debug Message: MetaverseWnd: Cannot find OBJID Metaverse_Character_Name_Value
Debug Message: MetaverseWnd: Cannot find OBJID Metaverse_Character_Race_Value
Debug Message: Creating Galaxy
Debug Message: Killing threads.
Debug Message: Kiling civs.
Debug Message: Killing ships.
Debug Message: Killing rallypoints.
Debug Message: Killing misc objects.
Debug Message: Killing stars.
Debug Message: Killing anomalies.
Debug Message: Killing space resources.
Debug Message: Killing colonies and planets.
Debug Message: killing scenario.
Debug Message: Clearing Turn Event Log
Debug Message: Clear galaxy settings.
Debug Message: Clear influence.
Debug Message: Clear up laws.
Debug Message: Clear first time events.
Debug Message: Clear wonders and trade goods.
Debug Message: Clear sector mapper.
Debug Message: Galaxy Size Set: 18 x 18
Debug Message: Creating Random Map
Debug Message: Creating Random Map... Stars
Debug Message: Number of Unplaced Stars: 0.
Debug Message: Creating Random Map... Planets
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: *************** Failed To Place Planet ***************
Debug Message: Creating Random Map... Anomalies
Debug Message: Num Anomalies: 300
Debug Message: Creating Random Map... Resources
Debug Message: Creating Random Map... Done
Debug Message: Setting Game Options
Debug Message: Creating Civs
Debug Message: Terran Alliance: Intellence -> 95
Debug Message: Altarian Republic: Intellence -> 95
Debug Message: Arcean Empire: Intellence -> 95

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Other than slightly old audio drivers I don't see anything wrong with your setup.

As for this:
"It's was a god dam save crash !!! What does video have to do with that ?"

Just when did you mention anything about a save crash?
This was your complaint:
"But it's getting harder since almost every time i play I end up with a lockup, an out of memory, or just a crash to desktop."

And, as you just said, you were playing on a beta that was found to have a memory bug.
And, it was a beta. There are proper steps to take to get an issue resolved.

Swearing and complaining is pointless. It is juvinile as well.

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